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The Big Book
The 12 and 12
24 Hours a Day
In honor of our 500th episode, we are re-issuing the episode reflecting on the life of our late son Andrew S.
We will be on hiatus for the next couple of weeks. We will be publishing open Talks for both App Owners and Premium Subscibers.
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In the Extras area of the App, we have a promotion flyer for the podcast. Just tap the lower case “e” located at the lower right hand of iPhone sceen and then tap PDF. Remember, in this same area of the app, we have the Big Book, the 12 and 12, along with a daily reader. Please support Sober Life Mouthwash, your support of this product supports the podcast.
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The Recovery Topic is The Orange Papers. We will study the words of the author and talk about what he has to say and what we can learn.
In the Introduction page of the website, the author writes “The Orange Papers is “an attempt to clarify my own thinking about A.A., and to explain to others why I felt that there was something wrong with people trying to shove Alcoholics Anonymous on patients”.
You thoughts on this purpose statement, specifically the word “shove”
What can we learn from this purpose statement?
The author was required to attend treatment. In the author’s words, “Most of the “course of treatment” consisted of compulsory attendance of Alcoholics Anonymous or Narcotics Anonymous 12-step meetings, and “group therapy” sessions where xeroxed copies of A.A. and N.A. literature was handed out and discussed by a 12-step true-believer group leader, someone who just assumed that of course everyone who recovers will do it at 12-step meetings.”
What can we learn from this?..
The author states, “I started out with a very positive view of Alcoholics Anonymous. Like most people, I had only heard good things about A.A., and thought that it was just a wonderful self-help group where alcoholics got together to give each other moral support and advice in quitting drinking.”
Your thoughts and what can we learn?
The author writes, “I mentioned the fact that a dozen years earlier, I had quit drinking, all on my own, and stayed quit for over three years. The counselor declared that I had not had a period of “recovery,””
Thoughts and what can we learn?
The author continues, “They (AA members) will always declare that you are not “in recovery” if you are not attending their Twelve-Step meetings and doing their Twelve Steps. You are “only abstaining” from drinking alcohol, or “only dry”, but not “sober”.
Thoughts and what can we learn?
p.164 vision for you
The author writes, “I came to the conclusion that Alcoholics Anonymous is really just a cult religion, one that passes off its proselytizing under the guise of alcoholism treatment, in just the same way as the Church of Scientology sells its cultish psycho-babble and techno-babble nonsense as self-improving psychotherapy.
Thoughts, what can we learn?
cult
kəlt/Submit
noun
a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object.
“the cult of St. Olaf”
a relatively small group of people having religious beliefs or practices regarded by others as strange or sinister.
“a network of Satan-worshiping cults”
synonyms:sect, denomination, group, movement, church, persuasion, body, faction More
a misplaced or excessive admiration for a particular person or thing.
“a cult of personality surrounding the leaders”
synonyms:obsession with, fixation on, mania for, passion for, idolization of, devotion to, worship of, veneration of More
The author writes, “Bill Wilson talks at length about the need to be freed from ego, the need to be freed from “the bondage of self.” But Mr. Wilson’s methods are ineffective and harmful to people. He makes students wallow in guilt and shame, and grinds their faces in the mud.
Thoughts, what can we learn?
The author writes, “Wilson repeatedly declared that all alcoholics must be rid of selfishness: “Selfishness, self-centeredness! That, we think, is the root of our troubles.” But you will find out that what Wilson really means by that is that you must spend all of your time recruiting and indoctrinating new members for Alcoholics Anonymous.
Thoughts, what can we learn?
“Spiritual, not religious,” but it is really “Superstitious, not religious.”
Thoughts, what can we learn?
The author writes, “A.A. assures the students that they will get good results from working the program, if they are willing to go to any length to get sobriety, and if they really try, but the truth is that they almost invariably will not get the promised results. A.A. has a failure rate that ranges from 95% to 100%. “
Thoughts, what can we learn?
The author writes, “One young was having a problem with “giving herself completely” to the 12-step program, one of the resident true believers announced that the answer to all such problems is “Do The Twelve Steps, Get A Sponsor, and Read The Big Book.” Well, it didn’t work. She relapsed repeatedly, and they kicked her out of the program.
Thoughts, what can we learn?
The author writes, “I just can’t help but think that there must be some better way to handle such problems than a method that is obviously not working, the currently-used 12-step program. I can’t help but think that a lot of people might be better off if they got some other treatment or therapy besides cult religion and voodoo medicine.”
Thoughts, what can we learn?
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Tonight, we are going to talk about meetings. Specifically, meeting types.
Meetings are the foundation for a recovery program.
It’s where we learn about the program.
It’s likely the place we will meet our sponsor.
It’s a place to get phone numbers
It’s where we meet sober friends.
So Zach, let’s talk about the many different meeting formats
Let’s talk about the ones we have experienced.
the ones we like
the ones we don’t like
we may even talk about meetings we have heard about
Zach, your initial thoughts on this subject.
Cristie, how about you, what first came to your mind when you knew we would be talking about meeting formats.
there are some common elements
Speaker intro followed by opening prayer, usually the serenity prayer
The preamble -3. Alcoholics Anonymous is a fellowship of men and women who share their experience,strength and hope …
“How it Works”
from here on, it’s a mixed bag
Traditions)
new members to introduce themselves by their first name only–
Ask any visitors to introduce themselves and say where they are from.
Make regular announcements about group business, events and announcements from The
Pass the basket(s). The secretary can say something like:
have no dues or fees in A.A.
introduce the speaker followed by discussion
announce the topic to the room and discussion
here in SE michigan, we break into small table discussions
meeting types such as:
lead discussion
big book
step study
We have phone calls,
Would you like to take a call?
Bronte Arrow Below
grape vine
12 & 12 study
Tradition Study
Meditation
Group Conscience
We have more calls,
want to take another call?
Barbara From oregon
read literature and share
crosstalk
meditation
group therapy
digs
open talk
standing, no chairs
smoking
eating
with kids
friends and family included
intervention meetings
with a therapist
with a specialist
one big room
small groups
outside
beach
mountains
at treatment centers
most unusual
most memorable
worst
best
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Jim and Jason, we’ve been asked by many of our listeners, “How do we select a Treatment Program?” So I thought I’d ask you guys who have experience in the field some questions our listeners would like to Ask about Treatment Programs
Questions like…
how long?
how much?
what guarantee?
Have you heard these questions before Jim?
Alright then…So Jim, How long?
What about it Jason, how much?
Ok guys, what’s the guarantee?
1. Let’s start at the beginning. The first step in any Treatment is an assessment.
How do you know if you need treatment?
First of all what is an assessment and why is it important?
Do Treatment Facilities have different levels of care? What is important?
What are the Levels of Care available? What is critical?
How are clients evaluated during the treatment process, do clients get re-assessed?
What is eligibility criteria?
What about dual diagnosis? How do facilities deal with co-occurring mental health problems?
Does the program treat mental health problems?
What about the use of Medication-Assisted Treatment?
What about a client on meds, can facilities manage medications?
2 What about COMPREHENSIVE INTEGRATED TREATMENT
What is it?
What types?
What questions should be asked about Medical Care –
What about Sexual Health services, what might be available?
Trauma Services
Educational/Vocational Assistance
Other Services
What about the recovering community?
4. STAFF QUALIFICATIONS AND TRAINING
staff-to-patient ratio?
What is the general nature of the staff?
Do treatment centers have doctors?
How about nurses?
What about the techs?
5. PAYING FOR TREATMENT
Payment Questions
What is the cost of the program? –
Is insurance accepted? –
financial aid? –
payment plan or sliding scale? –
6. ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS ABOUT THE PROGRAM
Is the program 12 step based?
What about evidence based treatment?
What about group therapy?
Individual treatment?
Is the program licensed by the state? Can some operate without a license?
What is the accreditation status of the program?
7. QUESTIONS TO ASK ABOUT FAMILY INVOLVEMENT
Friends and family, this is commonright? What is it?
Why is it important?
Al Anon?
11. CONTINUING CARE AND RECOVERY SUPPORTS
Does the treatment taper off so youth gradually leave the safety of the program?
Does the program design a continuing care plan that specifies what youth should do after they are discharged — such as get involved with positive free time activities?
Does the program provide referrals to community services that offer things for your child to do that don’t involve drug or alcohol use?
Any other things the program does to help the ongoing recovery process?
Once the program ends, does the staff conduct a few check-ups to see how things are going?
12. PROGRAM EVALUATION
Have you had your program evaluated?
What types of data have you collected and analyzed?
What are the outcomes of the evaluation?
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This Open Talk is for everybody. Other products are made exclusively for our Recovered App owners. Thanks for the support! If you upgrade to Premium, your contribution will help keep us on the web.
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